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steve
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 Posted: Wed Mar 28, 2007 7:59 pm Post subject: Simple Backup with NTBackup |
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Im doing some work with a small charity with a windows 2003 server.
It is a a small organization with maybe 10 fulltime staff and 50
Volunteers. Up to this point they have not had a backup.
Im suggesting for simplicity and cost just to buy two Drives and swap
them out each week. The data is not updated that much ( C drive is 35
gig with about 5 gigs of data and d is a 35 gig with maybe 20 gigs of
data)
Im thinking that we should just do a full backup on saturday, then
monday to friday do an incremental backup. then start the whole
process over again.
I was even thinking if we had two drives say 250 gig. I could do
something like have several backups eg Week1 Week2 Week3 Week4.
Again this is a small organization and not very complex. But obviously
a backup is imporntant. Not that they had one up to this point.
If I call a bu week1, then week 2 (the saturday complete backup) and
set the bu when it finds the existing BU called Week1 to just
overwrite, then that would take care of deleting previous week1's eg
overwrite. This would mean no maintinence by anyone accept to swap out
drives. (and frankly by the way on weeks that might have 5 weeks if
the disks get out of wack and it really doesnt mater, that data doesnt
change that much even if you can restor from last month it not going
to make much difference)
The question I have is about the incremental backups. How can I delete
the incremental backup every week so that they are fresh every week
and dont just keep building up. (do you know what I mean.)
I would prefer not to have the charity buy software, since the
ntbackup is already there.
Regards. |
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Zadok
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| Posted: Thu Mar 29, 2007 12:56 am Post subject: Re: Simple Backup with NTBackup |
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On 28 Mar 2007 08:59:32 -0700, "steve" <stevesemple@lycos.com> wrote:
| Quote: |
The question I have is about the incremental backups. How can I delete
the incremental backup every week so that they are fresh every week
and dont just keep building up. (do you know what I mean.)
|
You simply need to make a .bat file to erase all of the files on a
drive or in a folder. When they swap the drive then erase it. Be sure
to add a few "pause" with echo warnings. Something like:
erase H:\backups\* /f /s /q
tailored to your needs should do nicely.
Be sure the drive letter is correct and put your backups in a unique
folder.
-- Zadok
('¿') |
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steve
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| Posted: Thu Mar 29, 2007 9:31 pm Post subject: Re: Simple Backup with NTBackup |
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On Mar 28, 3:56 pm, Zadok <Z...@utopia.net> wrote:
| Quote: |
On 28 Mar 2007 08:59:32 -0700, "steve" <stevesem...@lycos.com> wrote:
The question I have is about the incremental backups. How can I delete
the incremental backup every week so that they are fresh every week
and dont just keep building up. (do you know what I mean.)
You simply need to make a .bat file to erase all of the files on a
drive or in a folder. When they swap the drive then erase it. Be sure
to add a few "pause" with echo warnings. Something like:
erase H:\backups\* /f /s /q
tailored to your needs should do nicely.
Be sure the drive letter is correct and put your backups in a unique
folder.
-- Zadok
('¿')
|
I guess you would put this in the bat file that has a backup script in
it. Just put it before the backup script.
I have a question about Normal and Copy backups in NT backup.
Normal clears the archive bit. If I do a complete backup over writing
the previous Full Normal backup on Saturday will that mean that I
will get a full backup of ALL files (old and new) or will I only get
the changed files in this new backup.
The reason I ask is because I guess what I think I want to do is do a
complete normal backup on Saturday. Set the archive bit then do an
incremental backup throughout the next 7 days then start the whole
thing over again. eg Complete backup of everything (normal?) and
incremental until next complete backup.
Does this make sense?
Regards |
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Zadok
Guest
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| Posted: Thu Mar 29, 2007 11:43 pm Post subject: Re: Simple Backup with NTBackup |
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On 29 Mar 2007 10:31:47 -0700, "steve" <stevesemple@lycos.com> wrote:
| Quote: |
On Mar 28, 3:56 pm, Zadok <Z...@utopia.net> wrote:
On 28 Mar 2007 08:59:32 -0700, "steve" <stevesem...@lycos.com> wrote:
The question I have is about the incremental backups. How can I delete
the incremental backup every week so that they are fresh every week
and dont just keep building up. (do you know what I mean.)
You simply need to make a .bat file to erase all of the files on a
drive or in a folder. When they swap the drive then erase it. Be sure
to add a few "pause" with echo warnings. Something like:
erase H:\backups\* /f /s /q
tailored to your needs should do nicely.
Be sure the drive letter is correct and put your backups in a unique
folder.
|
You'd want to run it only before the full backup to clear the backup
folder. If you run it before your incremental then you'll wipe out
your previous work.
| Quote: |
-- Zadok
('¿')
I guess you would put this in the bat file that has a backup script in
it. Just put it before the backup script.
I have a question about Normal and Copy backups in NT backup.
Normal clears the archive bit. If I do a complete backup over writing
the previous Full Normal backup on Saturday will that mean that I
will get a full backup of ALL files (old and new) or will I only get
the changed files in this new backup.
|
Normal copies all files making previous backups history.
| Quote: |
The reason I ask is because I guess what I think I want to do is do a
complete normal backup on Saturday. Set the archive bit then do an
incremental backup throughout the next 7 days then start the whole
thing over again. eg Complete backup of everything (normal?) and
incremental until next complete backup.
Does this make sense?
Regards
|
I think you are confusing yourself with terminology: A "complete"
backup can ge either a normal or copy backup. Personally I don't do
copy backups. I do normal and then differential during the week.
A copy backup copies all selected files but does not mark each file as
having been backed up (in other words, the archive attribute is not
cleared). Copying is useful if you want to back up files between
normal and incremental backups because copying does not affect these
other backup operations.
A normal backup copies all selected files and marks each file as
having been backed up (in other words, the archive attribute is
cleared). With normal backups, you need only the most recent copy of
the backup file or tape to restore all of the files. You usually
perform a normal backup the first time you create a backup set.
A differential backup copies files created or changed since the last
normal or incremental backup. It does not mark files as having been
backed up (in other words, the archive attribute is not cleared). If
you are performing a combination of normal and differential backups,
restoring files and folders requires that you have the last normal as
well as the last differential backup.
An incremental backup backs up only those files created or changed
since the last normal or incremental backup. It marks files as having
been backed up (in other words, the archive attribute is cleared). If
you use a combination of normal and incremental backups, you will need
to have the last normal backup set as well as all incremental backup
sets in order to restore your data.
-- Zadok
('¿') |
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steve
Guest
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| Posted: Fri Mar 30, 2007 12:02 am Post subject: Re: Simple Backup with NTBackup |
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Thank you for this its helpfull.
You say ....
| Quote: |
I do normal and then differential during the week.
|
Just to be clear (because backups are important I want to be clear. )
If you choose to backup all files in a "normal" backup this will
backup everything regardless of archive bit.
As it backs up it clears the Archive bit.
Why do a Differential backup as opposed to an Incremental backup
during the week. eg Monday_icrem.bkf Tuesday_increm.bkf etc. I mean
dont you want to CLEAR THE ARCHIVE bit so you dont back it up again.
Or is your thinking that every day you do a differential backup to the
same file overwriting the day before's, so that if you do a restor all
the previous backups back to the last Normal Backup are just in one
file. Which probably makes Prety good sense.
Thanks. |
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Zadok
Guest
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| Posted: Fri Mar 30, 2007 8:32 pm Post subject: Re: Simple Backup with NTBackup |
|
|
On 29 Mar 2007 13:02:15 -0700, "steve" <stevesemple@lycos.com> wrote:
| Quote: |
Thank you for this its helpfull.
You say ....
I do normal and then differential during the week.
Just to be clear (because backups are important I want to be clear. )
If you choose to backup all files in a "normal" backup this will
backup everything regardless of archive bit.
|
yes
| Quote: |
As it backs up it clears the Archive bit.
|
yes
| Quote: |
Why do a Differential backup as opposed to an Incremental backup
during the week. eg Monday_icrem.bkf Tuesday_increm.bkf etc. I mean
dont you want to CLEAR THE ARCHIVE bit so you dont back it up again.
|
This is your choice depending on what you want to do, what your needs
are, amount of data etc. Of course we are assuming that you only need
to keep recent copies of files and not any sort of version history.
| Quote: |
Or is your thinking that every day you do a differential backup to the
same file overwriting the day before's, so that if you do a restor all
the previous backups back to the last Normal Backup are just in one
file. Which probably makes Prety good sense.
|
Again... What ever suits your needs. For example: If you do a normal
backup then 10 differentials then you don't need every one for a
restore. You can delete any in between without loosing anything. If
the differential gets too large then do a normal and start over.
I suggest you try anything and see how it goes. Be sure to test your
backup by doing a restore so you don't get suprised down the road. You
can change your scheme anytime you wish and try something else.
-- Zadok
('¿') |
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steve
Guest
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| Posted: Fri Mar 30, 2007 9:21 pm Post subject: Re: Simple Backup with NTBackup |
|
|
| Quote: |
Why do a Differential backup as opposed to an Incremental backup
during the week. eg Monday_icrem.bkf Tuesday_increm.bkf etc. I mean
dont you want to CLEAR THE ARCHIVE bit so you dont back it up again.
This is your choice depending on what you want to do, what your needs
are, amount of data etc. Of course we are assuming that you only need
to keep recent copies of files and not any sort of version history.
Right, |
| Quote: |
Or is your thinking that every day you do a differential backup to the
same file overwriting the day before's, so that if you do a restor all
the previous backups back to the last Normal Backup are just in one
file. Which probably makes Prety good sense.
Again... What ever suits your needs. For example: If you do a normal
backup then 10 differentials then you don't need every one for a
restore. You can delete any in between without loosing anything. If
the differential gets too large then do a normal and start over.
|
I understand that everything is My Preference etc.
But does it make sense (Once you have done a full Normal backup) to do
a diff each day and over write the same Diff file over and over each
day. This seems to be the direction Im leaning in. I want it low
maintenance. Then once a week do another full normal and start the
diff backup again.
| Quote: |
I suggest you try anything and see how it goes. Be sure to test your
backup by doing a restore so you don't get suprised down the road. You
can change your scheme anytime you wish and try something else.
|
Thanks Im testing some things out now. |
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Will Niccolls
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| Posted: Wed Apr 04, 2007 11:24 pm Post subject: Re: Simple Backup with NTBackup |
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"steve" <stevesemple@lycos.com>> I understand that everything is My
Preference etc.
| Quote: |
But does it make sense (Once you have done a full Normal backup) to do
a diff each day and over write the same Diff file over and over each
day. This seems to be the direction Im leaning in. I want it low
maintenance. Then once a week do another full normal and start the
diff backup again.
|
Yes, makes good sense. Depending on the type of data you might check out
www.mozy.com
It's not free but it is very reasonable for 50GB of data backup, maybe < 60$
year. No worries about offsite storage, easy restores, no drives to buy.
I say "depending on the type of data" because I don't think it will handle
say Exchange or live database backups--at least without configuring them to
backup to an offline file first. |
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Al Dykes
Guest
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| Posted: Wed Apr 04, 2007 11:33 pm Post subject: Re: Simple Backup with NTBackup |
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|
In article <635o03p03u4jr7nvsmb7a8j1cepvuk2lb2@4ax.com>,
Zadok <Zadok@utopia.net> wrote:
| Quote: |
On 29 Mar 2007 10:31:47 -0700, "steve" <stevesemple@lycos.com> wrote:
On Mar 28, 3:56 pm, Zadok <Z...@utopia.net> wrote:
On 28 Mar 2007 08:59:32 -0700, "steve" <stevesem...@lycos.com> wrote:
The question I have is about the incremental backups. How can I delete
the incremental backup every week so that they are fresh every week
and dont just keep building up. (do you know what I mean.)
You simply need to make a .bat file to erase all of the files on a
drive or in a folder. When they swap the drive then erase it. Be sure
to add a few "pause" with echo warnings. Something like:
erase H:\backups\* /f /s /q
tailored to your needs should do nicely.
Be sure the drive letter is correct and put your backups in a unique
folder.
You'd want to run it only before the full backup to clear the backup
folder. If you run it before your incremental then you'll wipe out
your previous work.
-- Zadok
('¿')
I guess you would put this in the bat file that has a backup script in
it. Just put it before the backup script.
I have a question about Normal and Copy backups in NT backup.
Normal clears the archive bit. If I do a complete backup over writing
the previous Full Normal backup on Saturday will that mean that I
will get a full backup of ALL files (old and new) or will I only get
the changed files in this new backup.
Normal copies all files making previous backups history.
The reason I ask is because I guess what I think I want to do is do a
complete normal backup on Saturday. Set the archive bit then do an
incremental backup throughout the next 7 days then start the whole
thing over again. eg Complete backup of everything (normal?) and
incremental until next complete backup.
Does this make sense?
Regards
I think you are confusing yourself with terminology: A "complete"
backup can ge either a normal or copy backup. Personally I don't do
copy backups. I do normal and then differential during the week.
A copy backup copies all selected files but does not mark each file as
having been backed up (in other words, the archive attribute is not
cleared). Copying is useful if you want to back up files between
normal and incremental backups because copying does not affect these
other backup operations.
A normal backup copies all selected files and marks each file as
having been backed up (in other words, the archive attribute is
cleared). With normal backups, you need only the most recent copy of
the backup file or tape to restore all of the files. You usually
perform a normal backup the first time you create a backup set.
A differential backup copies files created or changed since the last
normal or incremental backup. It does not mark files as having been
backed up (in other words, the archive attribute is not cleared). If
you are performing a combination of normal and differential backups,
restoring files and folders requires that you have the last normal as
well as the last differential backup.
An incremental backup backs up only those files created or changed
since the last normal or incremental backup. It marks files as having
been backed up (in other words, the archive attribute is cleared). If
you use a combination of normal and incremental backups, you will need
to have the last normal backup set as well as all incremental backup
sets in order to restore your data.
-- Zadok
('¿')
|
Space willing, I always liked "delta" backups. That means you onle
need the full backup and th last one to do a full restore, and the
prior delta tapes are spares in the drive eats last night's/
For disk-to-disk, set the "compress" property ON for thetarget disk
and you'll get the feature that every "modern" backup tool incudes and
get twice as many savestes on a disk.
Buy two large disks dedicated to backup. Put each in a seperate
computer on your net and share both of them out.
On your server, make two backup scripts and run them on alternate
days, backing up to alternate disks. Do a readback every noght to
make sure each backup is readable. If time is available, youi can
runn both, every night.
--
a d y k e s @ p a n i x . c o m
Don't blame me. I voted for Gore. A Proud signature since 2001 |
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steve
Guest
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| Posted: Sat Apr 07, 2007 4:24 pm Post subject: Re: Simple Backup with NTBackup |
|
|
On Apr 4, 3:33 pm, ady...@panix.com (Al Dykes) wrote:
| Quote: |
In article <635o03p03u4jr7nvsmb7a8j1cepvuk2...@4ax.com>,
Zadok <Z...@utopia.net> wrote:
On 29 Mar 2007 10:31:47 -0700, "steve" <stevesem...@lycos.com> wrote:
On Mar 28, 3:56 pm, Zadok <Z...@utopia.net> wrote:
On 28 Mar 2007 08:59:32 -0700, "steve" <stevesem...@lycos.com> wrote:
The question I have is about the incremental backups. How can I delete
the incremental backup every week so that they are fresh every week
and dont just keep building up. (do you know what I mean.)
You simply need to make a .bat file to erase all of the files on a
drive or in a folder. When they swap the drive then erase it. Be sure
to add a few "pause" with echo warnings. Something like:
erase H:\backups\* /f /s /q
tailored to your needs should do nicely.
Be sure the drive letter is correct and put your backups in a unique
folder.
You'd want to run it only before the full backup to clear the backup
folder. If you run it before your incremental then you'll wipe out
your previous work.
-- Zadok
('¿')
I guess you would put this in the bat file that has a backup script in
it. Just put it before the backup script.
I have a question about Normal and Copy backups in NT backup.
Normal clears the archive bit. If I do a complete backup over writing
the previous Full Normal backup on Saturday will that mean that I
will get a full backup of ALL files (old and new) or will I only get
the changed files in this new backup.
Normal copies all files making previous backups history.
The reason I ask is because I guess what I think I want to do is do a
complete normal backup on Saturday. Set the archive bit then do an
incremental backup throughout the next 7 days then start the whole
thing over again. eg Complete backup of everything (normal?) and
incremental until next complete backup.
Does this make sense?
Regards
I think you are confusing yourself with terminology: A "complete"
backup can ge either a normal or copy backup. Personally I don't do
copy backups. I do normal and then differential during the week.
A copy backup copies all selected files but does not mark each file as
having been backed up (in other words, the archive attribute is not
cleared). Copying is useful if you want to back up files between
normal and incremental backups because copying does not affect these
other backup operations.
A normal backup copies all selected files and marks each file as
having been backed up (in other words, the archive attribute is
cleared). With normal backups, you need only the most recent copy of
the backup file or tape to restore all of the files. You usually
perform a normal backup the first time you create a backup set.
A differential backup copies files created or changed since the last
normal or incremental backup. It does not mark files as having been
backed up (in other words, the archive attribute is not cleared). If
you are performing a combination of normal and differential backups,
restoring files and folders requires that you have the last normal as
well as the last differential backup.
An incremental backup backs up only those files created or changed
since the last normal or incremental backup. It marks files as having
been backed up (in other words, the archive attribute is cleared). If
you use a combination of normal and incremental backups, you will need
to have the last normal backup set as well as all incremental backup
sets in order to restore your data.
-- Zadok
('¿')
Space willing, I always liked "delta" backups. That means you onle
need the full backup and th last one to do a full restore, and the
prior delta tapes are spares in the drive eats last night's/
For disk-to-disk, set the "compress" property ON for thetarget disk
and you'll get the feature that every "modern" backup tool incudes and
get twice as many savestes on a disk.
Buy two large disks dedicated to backup. Put each in a seperate
computer on your net and share both of them out.
On your server, make two backup scripts and run them on alternate
days, backing up to alternate disks. Do a readback every noght to
make sure each backup is readable. If time is available, youi can
runn both, every night.
--
a d y k e s @ p a n i x . c o m
Don't blame me. I voted for Gore. A Proud signature since 2001- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -
|
Thanks again good ideas. |
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